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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 12, 2014 23:58:44 GMT
Your Username/Character: Dalekfodder Accused Player's Username/Character: Wittme91(Jace Evans) Time of Act: 13/03/2014 What did the accused player do?: First of all. The AI reported broken pipes at the gateway area. So I went there, with 2 of my dispensers. On the way, CE found me, took one of the dispensers and lead the way (On another note he was going to arrivals instead of gateway, even though he heard the gateway part) So when we arrived there, the engineers there was waiting the security to be finished. However CE did not wait and did all the repairs himself, ignoring the idle engineers. Later when it came to the pipes, he took my dispenser, told me to get out through the wall. So I did but I stood there.(basically I did this prntscr.com/30awwd ) saying I wanted to get the second dispenser inside... however all he did was throw some threats and scream at me, telling me to go away. Later instead of pushing the dispenser away and getting out of there using gateway door he called the security officer, who removed me then later I learned that he wanted me arrested for 15 minutes, please he wanted me demoted. So the officer told me that I'll serve 3 minutes, because I complied. (it was 5 total). So when I got out of brig, I walked to the atmospherics. I heard the CE saying that I was fired and if I had returned, I'd be charged with mutiny. So I requested captain's assistance by telling her that I have a complaint against the CE...Funny part, after I explained her the whole story, she told me that he's better than me for getting the job done.Later. When I told them that I was not incompetent, and that I did some modifications to Atmospherics for the safety of the crew, they told me that it's against the laws.Even funnier: THEY COULD NOT POINT THE LAW. And later I was told that I was getting arrested/demoted for an "unspoken law", totally legit. I proved that it was not against the law and they had to let me go anyways. Edit 1# : I forgot this: Captain told me that the CE can fire whoever he wants because the CE is the department head of the Engineering. Gamegod12 (Jennifer Hynes)
Evidence: When I was posting this I lost all the logs I had due to a relog. (pff) But I believe officer could prove some parts of it.
Additional comments or notes: Look. I believe that his app needs to be revised because being a head does not mean doing all the job...Being a head means leading your department people, assigning tasks to them, cheer them up when they need it, even sometimes tolerate the stuff they do because you're responsible for their actions, if one gets fired/fried, that's bad for you, you lose one guy. One guy with high potential.C'mon guys... Really... Also please get your facts straight when you do something. One last note: I was an atmospherics technician and when I did these mods, the CE was not in the shift.
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Post by Gamegod12 on Mar 13, 2014 0:46:03 GMT
Oh, to defend myself, I didn't come on as a head and you didn't let Jen finish what she was trying to say, she would have told you that she was worried about being blamed for fucking up as acting captain, so stress, go figure, oh, and SHE let you off after hearing about it, so thank her for saving your ass, Oh, AND she was inclined to listen to what the CE had to say, him being the CE and all, she thought he MIGHT have had all his facts straight, about space law and everything, ya know, once she found out, and you explained yourself and the mod, she let you off.
EDIT: Oh, AND (Final "and") she was worried about pissing the only official head of the station off, so she played ball with him, right till the end, where she saw reason :3
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witt
Moderator
The Banker
Posts: 238
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Post by witt on Mar 13, 2014 2:54:20 GMT
Alright. Let me see if I can clear this up for you Dalekfodder.
Jace is an abrasive character and he would rather do things himself. Now I get that you didn't like how that section of the round turned out for you. but honestly ((in my opinion)) making a complaint because a character was being mean to you is kind of silly.
This is how I see this: Yes Jace was an ass to you(( he is to everyone except two or three that have earned his trust)) but if you want to look at the round fully remember that I did rejoin the round to you dismembering my still live character (( And no Admins I am not going to request a ban or a complaint)). I let that go for two reasons (( I considered it penance for our fight and trying to drive gamegod insane is always fun.
So lets just burry the hatchet lock this thread and go back to our 2D spessmen.
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Post by Covert0ddity on Mar 13, 2014 3:20:17 GMT
This is actually a major problem that should begin to be touched on.
The problem is heads being the ultimatem overcontroller over their department. Being a head of a department doesn't mean. You know every knook and cranny. In fact, you should probably have a regular amount of skill as a normal person in your department, plus command skill.
The idea of a head has been completely warped and twisted over time. You don't do everything. And you probably shouldn't be very rash, unless it's some form of (justifiable) emotional outbreak.
Heads delegate tasks, and fire people who don't do them, or do them poorly. That's it. That's all. They don't need to know every part. And they shouldn't blow off the other engineers to get shit done.
Also, Witt, a lot of people have been complaining about you lately. The number is actually slightly disconcerting. My advice is that you review your behaviour lately, and see if you can mold it a tad, so that you don't get a complaint or ban request every other Tuesday.
I'll be withholding my actual vote, as I wasn't there, and there is no ev8dence. Even if there evidence, it would be a tough choice...
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farcry11
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God Emperor of Pleb Kind
Strictly Platonic
Posts: 1,347
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Post by farcry11 on Mar 13, 2014 3:38:24 GMT
I agree with Covert. Jace is abrasive, we get that... But why would NT move up such an abrasive lone wolf to the position of head? It seems you're only playing CE so you have all access to toy around with engineering. If you're going to keep playing Jace as a lone wolf, play him as a normal engineer and leave the CE position open for someone that actually does the job right.
Leaders lead. They don't get down in the muck and do the ACTUAL work. That's what you have underlings for. Use them, and stop being a station engineer with extra access. It's annoying and it seriously gets on people's nerves, including mine.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 13, 2014 10:12:50 GMT
Dismembering was an objective. And I was manipulated ICly.Secondly. You already cleared yourself you do not deserve a head spot in this 2D spessmen. Go play a station engineer instead.
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Post by echotango23 on Mar 13, 2014 13:56:18 GMT
Assholes exist. If you refuse the existence of abrasive people in positions of power Aurora might as well be changed from heavy RP to My Little Space Station 13 heavy RP(with the condition that everybody be nice to one another, teehee!)
And NT hires syndie operatives, changelings and cult members on the regular to positions of power, is a mean person really a stretch?
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farcry11
Moderator
God Emperor of Pleb Kind
Strictly Platonic
Posts: 1,347
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Post by farcry11 on Mar 13, 2014 13:58:02 GMT
Tango, I support the existence of asshole characters. I have a few myself. What I DONT support is people that think being a head is about doing everything in your department on your own because you can. Lone wolves are not hired as heads. It doesn't make any sense and therefore should not be done, but it is done by multiple people, including Jace. I don't care if he's abrasive or an asshole or a lone wolf, but if he wants to continue to be a "does everything himself" character, then he's not suited for a head position.
Read closer and deeper before you post.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 13, 2014 15:12:16 GMT
Echotango. First of all this complaint is not against him, being an asshole, this complaint is due to some people being whitelisted however failing to understand the basic concepts of being a head of staff . Which is kinda ridiculous because he was whitelisted you(admins) expected him to be a competent head of staff that -LEADS- the crew efficiently. Heads are supposed not to be lone wolfs. I hope you understand my concerns.
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Post by VoltageHero on Mar 13, 2014 19:07:01 GMT
Mar 13, 2014 11:12:16 GMT -4 Dalekfodder said:Echotango. First of all this complaint is not against him, being an asshole, this complaint is due to some people being whitelisted however failing to understand the basic concepts of being a head of staff . Which is kinda ridiculous because he was whitelisted you(admins) expected him to be a competent head of staff that -LEADS- the crew efficiently. Heads are supposed not to be lone wolfs. I hope you understand my concerns.Actually, it wasn't the admins who Whitelisted him. It was more or less the players. The admins only assumed they players had good judgement.
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Chaznoodles
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Broodhost
Syndicate CEO
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Post by Chaznoodles on Mar 13, 2014 23:27:30 GMT
From what I've read, this seems pretty legit. No further comment.
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Dr. Carver
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"It takes surgical precision to sever a jugular before they notice" -Agent Darko, Senior Field Agent
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Post by Dr. Carver on Mar 14, 2014 1:59:30 GMT
While I understand Jace's character is a bit of an asshole by choice and I fully support that because Carver is the same, he needs to delegate a few things. I do agree though, if your CE is doing something on their own and want to be left alone, run. Run away and do something else. Its fine if they ask you to do something, but the last thing I would want while performing surgery is someone else in the OR full stop, let alone doing nothing but ask if they can help.I have seen Jace command effectively before, so I don't agree with this one.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 14, 2014 6:35:28 GMT
Carver... That doesnt make anything right... Infact it makes you wrong too...Why?Well its simple, heads of staff are heads of staff because of their commanding skills. Not their engineering skill.Of course it matters too, but I doubt that all CE's are better than station engineers or atmos...The another problem with this guy is he cant even get his facts straight! Really... He told me that I violated a ten thousand regulations of atmospherics because I built an external port filter to avoid incidents...(( the ce was not in the shift when I did this, too )) when I told him to show this law, he couldnt icly, so when I told him to show it oocly, the captain told me that itsan unspoken rule...
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Dr. Carver
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"It takes surgical precision to sever a jugular before they notice" -Agent Darko, Senior Field Agent
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Post by Dr. Carver on Mar 14, 2014 10:14:44 GMT
I understand what you mean, but are are you saying that bosses aren't allowed to do their own work? When the station is quiet, I allow everyone to go on break while I hold down medbay. If there is only one job that needs doing, allow the head to do it and go for some busy-work. Oh, and there is a few rules against modification to the station. If they are structurally integrated, then don't try without a heads permission. I have been arrested for a few times for that.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 14, 2014 11:10:25 GMT
Carver, not when there are 3 idle engineers staring at the explosion area... Also, if that law is not stated in the space law too bad, your arrest was illegal. But really. Its just silly atmospherics technicians SHOULD be able to do mods. Er,.. Since they are the atmospherics technician.
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Dr. Carver
Donator
"It takes surgical precision to sever a jugular before they notice" -Agent Darko, Senior Field Agent
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Post by Dr. Carver on Mar 14, 2014 12:03:13 GMT
The law comes under vandalism. Believe me, I know. Its one of the reasons I hate security, but I digress... Jace did fine for his character although I agree that he should have delegated, but we do not have the gift of hindsight until it is too late. Sometimes it only takes one extra cook to ruin a perfectly good Carvery.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 14, 2014 14:53:15 GMT
Really, a CE can not blame the tech because the tech built something when the CE was late. Also, it was a really small modification, AN USEFUL modification.
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witt
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The Banker
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Post by witt on Mar 14, 2014 15:12:49 GMT
Dalek,
Server SoP has procedures on top of procedures for this. When there is no CE you report to the captain or most relevant head that is active. The Issue I had is not that you modified the system. but that you failed to alert any heads of this, or even bothered to alert me that you made the modifications when I did join the round.
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Post by Dalekfodder on Mar 14, 2014 17:09:00 GMT
I've talked to Skull, we are using Bay12's SOP, they don't have that in their SOP. Also, according to Skull our station SOP is under developement, and it doesn't have that in, too. What's your excuse?
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Dr. Carver
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"It takes surgical precision to sever a jugular before they notice" -Agent Darko, Senior Field Agent
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Post by Dr. Carver on Mar 14, 2014 17:58:33 GMT
Please don't keep arguing. Witt did nothing wrong apart from not delegating. It was fine that you were trying to help, but he evidently didn't want it and you were bugging him.. Jace is Jace through and through. If you don't want a character to yell at your character, don't associate with him. You have learned a valuable lesson today and that is to avoid Jace.
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