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Post by nebulaflare on Sept 29, 2013 12:32:09 GMT
Agree or disagree, but I'm very insistent on every engineer/atmos tech/chief engineer to be strutting around like this...at least I make a conscious effort for it.
On Person
On station/out of EVA Head: Hardhat Eyes: Meson Scanners Mask: None Ear: Communications Earpiece Jumpsuit: Uniform Exo-Suit: (optional, I don't use it) none/emergency jacket/ Firesuit (if you're fighting fire) -pockets of exo-suit: roll of gauze/ointment Gloves: insulated gloves (including atmos techs) Shoes: Orange Shoes Suit Storage: N/A
Within EVA Conditions Head: Hardsuit engie helmet Eyes: Meson Scanners Mask: gasmask Ear: Communications Earpiece Jumpsuit: Uniform Exo-Suit: Engineering Hardsuit Gloves: insulated gloves (including atmos techs) Shoes: Magboots Suit Storage: O2 tank filled to the max pressure
ID slot: PDA with ID inside
Belt slot: Toolbelt -Welders -wirecutters -cable coil -multitool -screwdriver -crowbar -wrench
Back slot: Backpack -one stack of metal -one stack of glass -fire extinguisher -a box of pizza -*free slot* (firesuit? I carry my gasmask here) -*free slot* (high capacity power cell? unless you sneakily manage to hide one in the box) -Cardboard box
inside cardboard box --extended release emergency o2 tank filled to max pressure --face mask --cable coil --station bounced radio --black gloves (why have this when you're wearing insulated? why, because they're stun gloves, silly!) --welding goggles -- *free slot* (a stolen security earpiece! It's fun to listen in on their channel.)
Brown webbing vest (attached to uniform) -airlock electronics -power control module -air alarm electronics -*free slot* -*free slot*
Pockets -T-ray scanner -Flash (Even if I'm not CE I get my hands on one. How? Not telling...)
Yes...that's quite a lot of stuff. You can carry a flashlight too, but I never seem to need it with the mesons and hardhat lights. I'd argue that engineers should carry a gasmask and hardsuit helmet in their bag, and wear the hardsuit and magboots at all times....breaches can happen at any moment. You wouldn't have time to run to engineering to grab the gear, and an engineer who is used to EVA would be fine wearing the suit on station. At least that's my opinion. I've always played engineer as some form of emergency response engie.
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mrimatool
Lore Developer
Your guy, Toolio <3
Posts: 703
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Post by mrimatool on Sept 29, 2013 16:09:50 GMT
First off flashes are in tech storage, second running around in full EVA with nothing going on can lead to kicks/bans/warnings/IC punishments, as it can and will be considered playiiiiinnnnng to wiiiiiiin~ engies also shouldn't be wandering round with stun gloves at any point, same situation with cable ties. I dissaprove incredibly.
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Post by Skull132 on Sept 29, 2013 17:06:27 GMT
Question: would full EVA mean someone wearing hardsuit, magboots, helmet, and a mask at the same time? Now, if this is the case, then is wearing a hardsuit, while having a helm in hand/in ruck more acceptable?
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mrimatool
Lore Developer
Your guy, Toolio <3
Posts: 703
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Post by mrimatool on Sept 29, 2013 20:31:07 GMT
It's more acceptable, but that suit weighs a ridiculous amount.. you would never want to wear it around, we have hazard vests, you have internals, if I let engies wander round in full EVA I might aswell let sec do the same, or let sec wander round in full gear with lasers drawn.
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Post by nebulaflare on Sept 29, 2013 23:04:55 GMT
Edit: Ok, wall of text, yes. But I can't edit the paragraph breaks in. I tried...
Walking around with the hardsuit comes at the expense of moving more slowly. There's a backlash to wearing the hardsuit often, but sec doesn't have one (mechanics wise) with wearing armor. Not to mention, an engineer walking around in a hardsuit is usually going in and out of EVA - which happens quite often.
Wearing the helmet and gasmask throughout the shift, I'd understand as being power playing. You can hide your face easily, and it would worry the crew. Same reason why sec doesn't wear armor in green alert - don't agitate the crew. Wearing the hardsuit only is a bit more friendly. And I would think an engineer's hardsuit is designed with freedom of movement and comfort in mind, since engineers are naturally the ones that go EVA the most (Aside from miners).
For a station that's often in the line of meteor showers (and exploding computers from someone trying to meta), having a hardsuit ready makes the engineer more efficient and productive. It's like the doctor expected to have a first aid kit at all times. The only ways to carry a hardsuit is either to wear it, or carry it in your hand - and I would assume carrying it around is more cumbersome.
Every other department hardsuit is stored away in EVA storage - which is carefully watched over with motion sensors, security, and watchful crewmembers. The engineering department have their suits right within reach. They're expected to be ready at a moment's notice.
Nearly every other major department wears an acceptable exosuit. Doctors and scientists get a coat that gives them pockets and suit storage. The detective gets a jacket. And the warden gets a coat that can equip a weapon. Even the Head of Security gets an armored trenchcoat he can wear in code green. At any moment without warning, the HoS could be thrown into a situation where he'd need that trenchcoat. Why can't the CE wear his/her special exosuit when they can immediately be thrown into a situation that needs it?
Security are also expected to respond to threats - they carry their armor with them. Engineers can't carry a hardsuit in their bag. You could argue that they have the orange emergency vests, but those are absolutely useless. Last I checked, those vests can't carry an O2 tank in the suit storage. Those two extra pockets the vest gives are not needed, with a brown webbing vest, a toolbelt, and still plenty space in an industrial bag/satchel. If that emergency vest could equip an o2 tank instead, (freeing up the need of replacing the toolbelt with a tank, and forcing the engie to carry the toolbelt in their bag - where you'd expect an engineer to have on hand at all times) then I'd agree the hardsuit is overpowered. But the emergency vest is never used because it's useless. *Edit:I just checked again, and they can carry it. So I am more inclined to agree that the hardsuit can be left in favor of the vest, but I'd still argue that a seasoned engineer is used to a hardsuit (with an already implemented mechanic of slow movement to even out its use, not needing inceased metagame punishment) - and all other variables explained further in my post.
The two main advantages the hardsuit gives are EVA protection, and an easily stored O2 tank. An engineer needs that more than any other department, and only the hardsuit can provide it. I don't recall if firesuits can equip an O2 tank - I think they can store the emergency/extended versions (can they even be placed in a bag? I checked the wiki and it says no). But those are much more eye-catching "there's danger on the station" than a hardsuit. Fires are less expected, since the variables are easier to control and prevent than a sudden depressurization. A trained engie/atmos tech can use a firesuit as EVA protection, but again, they don't fit in the bags like security armor.
Security and engineering are the most dangerous jobs. Security is expected to protect the crew from those that disrupt the peace, and engineering is to protect the crew from environmental hazards. You could argue that life threatening situations aren't expected to happen often, which is why the advanced security gear (e-guns, riot suits, etc) are locked away in the armory. But the engineering EVA aren't - they're readily available. Unless you want to compare the necessity e-guns and riot gear to engie hardsuits, then yes, hardsuits are overpowered. But just like medical kits in medbay, doctors can grab them quickly, just like engineers can grab EVA gear quickly.
Lastly, I'd assume a seasoned engie is already comfortable moving about in EVA gear. If they go to a bar and get a drink with their gasmask on, or go take a nap with their hardsuit on, then yeah, that would be weird. But I can't see what's wrong with sitting at a chair in the engineer monitoring office with a hardsuit (you're not moving much anyway), or walking down the halls with the hardsuit on. The only reason an engineer would even venture out of engiebay is because someone broke something. Or to order pizza from cargo. One of the two.
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Post by faithskirata on Sept 30, 2013 2:49:22 GMT
pls use enter key pls thx
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Post by nebulaflare on Sept 30, 2013 3:44:02 GMT
pls use enter key pls thx Edit: Ok, wall of text, yes. But I can't edit the paragraph breaks in. I tried... >_>
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Post by faithskirata on Sept 30, 2013 10:33:02 GMT
I didn't read the edit. Because it was part of the massive wall of text.
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Post by danmageddon on Sept 30, 2013 22:16:33 GMT
This board code for some reason condenses all empty lines into nothing, resulting in rampant text-walls. The only way to avoid is to post in the BBCode rather than using the interpreter.
Anyway, in response:
I love the idea of dragging some ointment or gauze around with you. Be nice if we could get some minor first-aid dispensers in engineering so we don't have to go running to medbay every time someone has the wrong gloves on.
I keep the resources for stungloves cable-cuffs on me (but then again, they are just things any engineer should have anyway), but I'll only actually construct the things when it seems they'll be needed.
I'm a personal fan of going around with my hardsuit worn, but having the helmet in my hand. It has that kind of nice casual 'stand-by' feeling to it, so you're not prepared for a meteor to crash into the very room you're in, and can still be caught by suprise, but you can quickly pull yourself into a ready status. Magboots I go without unless there's a crisis, they seem a bit heavy to be stomping around in all day.
I do have the rule that if I'm in my hardsuit, I'm on active engineer duty, checking for faults and such, not just sitting in the bar or dossing about.
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Post by faithskirata on Sept 30, 2013 23:28:45 GMT
Walking around in a hardsuit in standard 1G should be fine, but probably only if you are "professional" in EVA. Y'know, because at that point, it's probably almost like a second, very big and clunky, skin.
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mrimatool
Lore Developer
Your guy, Toolio <3
Posts: 703
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Post by mrimatool on Sept 30, 2013 23:50:25 GMT
Hmm, both Dan and Faith's points are good ones, except Dan's point about stun gloves, eghh nasty things an engineer should never need. Yeah Faith, I like the idea of them having to have proffesional in EVA to waltz around in it when there's nothing going on.
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Post by danmageddon on Oct 3, 2013 15:52:23 GMT
It's a MacGyver improvised weapon that barely gives you chance to stun someone long enough to cable cuff 'em. Frankly, if an antag is defeated by someone who was carrying nothing but a battery, some cable, and gloves, when they themselves have a multitude of superpowers or awesome items they can spawn in, they kind of deserve it.
And yeah, I rank pro EVA without taking my character traits above Average.
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Post by tuiee on Oct 4, 2013 4:20:55 GMT
I don't carry around black gloves unless I'm going on a lightbulb changing run. I'm not sure why an engi would carry around a high cap cell unless they're giving power boosts to APCs. Keeping wire on your person is fine.
In other words, I don't really like engineers that can produce a pair of ready made stun gloves on the fly; especially when I have to deal with engis that think they're mothertruckin' Isaac Clarke. I've had a grudge against hero engis ever since one trashed an antag round I had by taking the law into his own hands and trying to kill my detective for bringing in a ling.
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Post by nikolaithebeast on Oct 11, 2013 2:29:11 GMT
I will point out that the hardsuits seem to be like power armor from fallout, so I always presumed they were trained to wear it. That's why we have softsuits as well. That's what I thought, if I'm wrong, We should make it that way.
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Post by tuiee on Oct 11, 2013 2:36:56 GMT
The suits are pretty much direct rips from Dead Space. Take that as you will.
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Post by nikolaithebeast on Oct 11, 2013 2:41:51 GMT
The suits are pretty much direct rips from Dead Space. Take that as you will. True, and mister Clarke is always in his. So they have to be comfy, right? It's like the HEV Suit. Which I was always disappointed we didn't have in game.
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Post by tuiee on Oct 11, 2013 2:49:58 GMT
The suits are pretty much direct rips from Dead Space. Take that as you will. True, and mister Clarke is always in his. So they have to be comfy, right? It's like the HEV Suit. Which I was always disappointed we didn't have in game. Exactly. I don't have an issue with engis walking around in the suit with their helmet off. I'm just not a big fan of engis with stungloves in their pocket.
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Post by danmageddon on Oct 11, 2013 15:50:00 GMT
The suits are pretty much direct rips from Dead Space. Take that as you will. True, and mister Clarke is always in his. So they have to be comfy, right? It's like the HEV Suit. Which I was always disappointed we didn't have in game. You'd be suprised how comfy you can learn to find something that is literally constantly the only thing seperating you from instant death. When it's not though, I reckon you'd get a bit stuffy in it.
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Post by danmageddon on Oct 11, 2013 15:51:28 GMT
I don't carry around black gloves unless I'm going on a lightbulb changing run. I'm not sure why an engi would carry around a high cap cell unless they're giving power boosts to APCs. Keeping wire on your person is fine. In other words, I don't really like engineers that can produce a pair of ready made stun gloves on the fly; especially when I have to deal with engis that think they're mothertruckin' Isaac Clarke. I've had a grudge against hero engis ever since one trashed an antag round I had by taking the law into his own hands and trying to kill my detective for bringing in a ling. Hero Engy is fine. Hero anything is fine. Heroes make for fun stories. Security aren't the only role allowed to actually do anything relating to antags, they're just the best equipped.
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Post by nikolaithebeast on Oct 11, 2013 18:30:18 GMT
I don't carry around black gloves unless I'm going on a lightbulb changing run. I'm not sure why an engi would carry around a high cap cell unless they're giving power boosts to APCs. Keeping wire on your person is fine. In other words, I don't really like engineers that can produce a pair of ready made stun gloves on the fly; especially when I have to deal with engis that think they're mothertruckin' Isaac Clarke. I've had a grudge against hero engis ever since one trashed an antag round I had by taking the law into his own hands and trying to kill my detective for bringing in a ling. Hero Engy is fine. Hero anything is fine. Heroes make for fun stories. Security aren't the only role allowed to actually do anything relating to antags, they're just the best equipped. Best not head, at least. And I remember getting in trouble because Engineer Nikolai carried a flash around and kept flashing antags who tried to kill him.
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